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MysticWitchKat 2052 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting TheNuge:" i have a very opinionated, ball-buster friend who went to Pakistan to vaccinate kids about 6 weeks ago. ... [snip!] ... he made it and he said it was great and the people were wonderful. Prior to the trip, he did not think highly of the citizens."


I think often people forget that the people in those countries are just like any others.

Buzz and Almond Joys momm 2 kids; Albuquerque, New Mexico 12593 posts
6th Dec '12

<blockquote><b>Quoting khigh:</b>" Because of people like me. I don't think radical Islamists can have a democracy. Sharia law is not able ... [snip!] ... and will never be able to peacefully rule themselves as long as they are following the Muslim Brotherhood and radical Islam."</blockquote>




I like the way you think :-)

TheNuge 1 child; Pennsylvania 23119 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting MysticWitchKat:" Well I mean in general, even in places without religion. Some places seem to be able to do it, and others seem to have issues."


Religion serves as the cover for many who just want power, money, property. etc. While i believe religion is the driver for a few nutty groups, i dont think it's the driving force for others. IMO, some cultures are just not recpetive to democracy. I think you have to place a very high value on human life and wanting to live a great life for democracy to work. also, you have to have an altuistic and compassionate society.

khigh 1 child; Fort Sill, Oklahoma 8101 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting MysticWitchKat:" I think often people forget that the people in those countries are just like any others. "

My main problem is that I have an Om tattoo on my wrist and the flag of India tattooed right above it and well, India and Pakistan don't really get along. It also might be different in the larger cities, but I'm going to be studying religious sites in the conservative Islamic border regions.



I got to sign a piece of paper that basically states that I understand that the United States does not negotiate with terrorists and that I understand I am going into a volatile region known for terrorist activity.

TheNuge 1 child; Pennsylvania 23119 posts
6th Dec '12

<blockquote><b>Quoting khigh:</b>" My main problem is that I have an Om tattoo on my wrist and the flag of India tattooed right above it ... [snip!] ... States does not negotiate with terrorists and that I understand I am going into a volatile region known for terrorist activity."</blockquote>




I have some elegant, long gloves that you may don while there. Shall I mail them out?

khigh 1 child; Fort Sill, Oklahoma 8101 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting TheNuge:" <blockquote><b>Quoting khigh:</b>" My main problem is that I have an Om tattoo on my ... [snip!] ... activity."</blockquote> I have some elegant, long gloves that you may don while there. Shall I mail them out?"


I bought a hijab and burka. I'm going to be all snazzy just showing my eyes!

TheNuge 1 child; Pennsylvania 23119 posts
6th Dec '12

<blockquote><b>Quoting MysticWitchKat:</b>" I think often people forget that the people in those countries are just like any others. "</blockquote>




I think that they are "just like us" in many ways. Sometimes I think that PERHAPS their culture doesn't allow them to get high enough in Maslows hierarchy of Needs for them to desire much more than basic survival plus a little more.

user banned 2 kids; Silly, Belgium 6539 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting khigh:" Oh no, I'm a huge fan of Israel. I'm talking about the Islamist countries (Iran, Syria, Libya, Egypt, etc). If only we could figure out how to do this: "


I really hope this isn't how everyone on BG feels. Not everyone in the Middle East is a terrorist or extremist and certainly don't deserve to be "blown off the map" as depicted in this backward picture. MOST of the Arabs just want PEACE. It's the governments that are destroying their own countries. Until you've walked in their shoes please don't make statements like this and encourage the ever growing racism. Sadly there is much warfare and many innocents are dying but it is the governments are 100% at fault and a lot of times the so-called 'interventions' are counterproductive because the governments also 'invent' terrorist groups or exaggerate existing terrorist groups to make the west afraid. This is usually an attempt to squander wealth and/or place fear in the hearts of the citizens who want to uprise against their unjust governments.

khigh 1 child; Fort Sill, Oklahoma 8101 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting Salad Fingers:" I really hope this isn't how everyone on BG feels. Not everyone in the Middle East is a terrorist or ... [snip!] ... to squander wealth and/or place fear in the hearts of the citizens who want to uprise against their unjust governments. "


The Taliban is not the government. Al Qaeda is not the government. The rebels are not the government. Do I think all Muslims are extremists? Nope. Do I profile when I go to the airport? Hell yeah. I speak Farsi and I do listen in on conversations when I can. I also have a few Turkish Muslim friends.

user banned 2 kids; Silly, Belgium 6539 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting khigh:" The Taliban is not the government. Al Qaeda is not the government. The rebels are not the government. ... [snip!] ... the airport? Hell yeah. I speak Farsi and I do listen in on conversations when I can. I also have a few Turkish Muslim friends."


No, they aren't, but I am not talking about them. They are the minority. I am talking about the official, internationally recognized governments. The governments that wage war on their own people. The governments that hinder the economic development of their own countries due to greed. The governments that favor certain sects and religions and punish the others simply for the language they speak or religion they follow. The governments who censor what their people learn and know. It's great you have friends and speak Farsi and listen to what people say. I am Middle Eastern and a very patriotic one at that and I hope for the best for my country and I think that ALL Arabs should unite as a single entity because at one time, we were a very important and intelligent race which developed many things that people still use today.

TheNuge 1 child; Pennsylvania 23119 posts
6th Dec '12

<blockquote><b>Quoting Salad Fingers:</b>" I really hope this isn't how everyone on BG feels. Not everyone in the Middle East is a terrorist or ... [snip!] ... to squander wealth and/or place fear in the hearts of the citizens who want to uprise against their unjust governments. "</blockquote>




Eh. It goes much beyond "their governments." When anti-government groups organize, they aren't the peace and freedom-loving kind.
Look at Egypt, Gaza, Sudan, Libya and Syria.

khigh 1 child; Fort Sill, Oklahoma 8101 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting Salad Fingers:" No, they aren't, but I am not talking about them. They are the minority. I am talking about the official, ... [snip!] ... because at one time, we were a very important and intelligent race which developed many things that people still use today."


Yeah....500+ years ago. And, I don't really care if the people want to blow each other up over there. But, I do care that they are taking the fight to other countries, mainly the US, Israel, and India. I care about those countries...I honestly don't care two shits about Iran, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt, etc. The people of Egypt brought this shit on themselves. THEY elected Assad.

user banned 2 kids; Silly, Belgium 6539 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting TheNuge:" <blockquote><b>Quoting Salad Fingers:</b>" I really hope this isn't how everyone ... [snip!] ... anti-government groups organize, they aren't the peace and freedom-loving kind. Look at Egypt, Gaza, Sudan, Libya and Syria."


Look at what their governments were doing to their people, though. Do you realize how happy the Egyptian people were when Mubarak was overthrown? He was a brutal and vicious dictator. Gaddafi (Libyan dictator) was a nutcase who killed and tortured people for sport. You're right, they aren't peaceful when they uprise. Peace gets the people nowhere except stripped from their families and thrown in a torture prison. They have to get the attention of the world in order to get any help. Standing around with picket signs simply isn't safe even in large numbers. We don't have the same rights under our governments as you all have over here. We don't have the right to have an opinion against our government. We can't simply say in public that "Obama sucks and is a horrible president" as American people can, because if the wrong person hears it, your being killed for treason. It's sad, and a better system definitely needs to be implemented. But that can't be solved by blowing the entire Middle East up. Unfortunately the majority of the Middle East with the gulf states being the only exception I can think of (because of wealth) hasn't seen peace or decent leadership since the Ottoman Empire. Under Saddam Hussein's rule in Iraq, Kurdish and Shi'aa Muslims were condemned and discriminated against. Under current Iraqi government, Sunni Muslims are being captured and put in jails for NO reason. There is always someone with an agenda.

user banned 2 kids; Silly, Belgium 6539 posts
6th Dec '12
Quoting khigh:" Yeah....500+ years ago. And, I don't really care if the people want to blow each other up over there. ... [snip!] ... Iran, Syria, Libya, Afghanistan, Iraq, Egypt, etc. The people of Egypt brought this shit on themselves. THEY elected Assad."


Not all five fingers are the same.

TheNuge 1 child; Pennsylvania 23119 posts
6th Dec '12

<blockquote><b>Quoting Salad Fingers:</b>" Look at what their governments were doing to their people, though. Do you realize how happy the Egyptian ... [snip!] ... Iraqi government, Sunni Muslims are being captured and put in jails for NO reason. There is always someone with an agenda."</blockquote>




I wasn't clear in what I wrote. I support overthrowing brutal dictators. I was referring to their replacements.