Reply
MomDIA TTC since May 2008; 81 kids; Warminster, Pennsylvania 3812 posts
9th Aug

<blockquote><b>Quoting Ravey Candyass:</b>" very much so. i was at the bar and had few drinks, got home and sked hubs to drive my sister to work ... [snip!] ... alcohol. i can tell you the second i got a call saying "i totaled my car, i've been in an accident" i sobered right the hell up"</blockquote>



Not to mention they could have been drinking the night before. I had a DUI so I had to take classes and they taught us that your alcohol levels rise while you sleep and are actually still high enough to be over the legal limit even after you slept it off.

_______Nope_________ 23772 posts
9th Aug
Quoting Just Ames:" Not to mention, I do not know how many of you have experience with drinking and smoking weed but something ... [snip!] ... such as an explosion is a sobering event. Meaning, I guarantee you their heads were in the right place when they got there."


I'm not so sure about that. A lot of people think they sober up, but in reality they haven't. The alcohol can still effect a person even if they think they're acting and thinking clearly.

Ravey Candyass 2 kids; 1 angel baby; Boston, Massachusetts 103128 posts
status 9th Aug
Quoting she nan igans:" I don't. I also missed the connection I guess, why the side of West TX mattered. I think the story ... [snip!] ... is very sad because no matter the autopsy reports I do think they were brave men who gave their lives trying to help people."


you know it's just not west Texas right? it's an actual city called West, Texas.

Just Ames 2 kids; 1 angel baby; Montego Bay, Jamaica 114793 posts
9th Aug
Quoting she nan igans:" I'm not so sure about that. A lot of people think they sober up, but in reality they haven't. The alcohol can still effect a person even if they think they're acting and thinking clearly. "

I'm pretty certain this particular event was devastating enough to gain the attention and focus it needed. So much that these men went straight to the front lines and lost their own lives in the process.

Just Ames 2 kids; 1 angel baby; Montego Bay, Jamaica 114793 posts
9th Aug
Quoting she nan igans:" I don't. I also missed the connection I guess, why the side of West TX mattered. I think the story ... [snip!] ... is very sad because no matter the autopsy reports I do think they were brave men who gave their lives trying to help people."

I asked if you knew the size of West, Texas because you said this could be reason to investigate further into the issue.



"Unlike full-time fire departments, such as ones found in Dallas and Houston, rural communities like West rely on volunteer firefighters who juggle those duties with outside jobs and are often less trained than career firefighters"



And this is why I'm against the reports being published. These were farmers, city employees, dads and husbands. While I understand they took an oath, I also am able to try and get into their mindset and that is this being a MAJOR catastrophe in a small town such as West. Of course their world stopped and they ran to the front lines. They were not getting paid for this service. They did it out of the kindness of their hearts and that should be what's talked about.

Just Ames 2 kids; 1 angel baby; Montego Bay, Jamaica 114793 posts
9th Aug

"The documents outline the grim injuries that struck the victims, including multiple skull and bone fractures, deep lacerations, and exposed or missing organs. Some of the men also had amputated limbs and one 
was decapitated."



"At least half of the firefighters still were covered in some of their protective gear

_______Nope_________ 23772 posts
9th Aug
Quoting Ravey Candyass:" you know it's just not west Texas right? it's an actual city called West, Texas."


Yes, that's what I figured. I guess I missed why it mattered how big it was. As in, I wasn't sure what I said that had to do with the size of the city?

Ravey Candyass 2 kids; 1 angel baby; Boston, Massachusetts 103128 posts
status 9th Aug
Quoting she nan igans:" Yes, that's what I figured. I guess I missed why it mattered how big it was. As in, I wasn't sure what I said that had to do with the size of the city? "


because it's population is under 3000. the size DOES matter. when there's n explosion that big, you need as much help as possible. and i'm sure that's exactly what was going through these two mens' heads.

_______Nope_________ 23772 posts
9th Aug
Quoting Just Ames:" I asked if you knew the size of West, Texas because you said this could be reason to investigate further ... [snip!] ... were not getting paid for this service. They did it out of the kindness of their hearts and that should be what's talked about."


ANd I 100% agree taht these men were heroes. That's why I said, I do not AT ALL feel this was a case of drunks doing bad things, or people not caring. These were men who likely had had the drinks prior to realizing there was an issue, then when a catastrophe DID happen, they rushed to the front lines to help, and ended up giving their lives for it. These were great men. I don't feel that knowing they'd had drinks beforehand or smoked pot diminishes that AT ALL, and for anyone who would feel it tarnishes them at all, that is sad.



I guess my point was only that the fact that there are volunteer firefighters who are under the influence is an issue. It didn't create problems here, and what happened was as travesty, but it still is a danger. It's like, a Dr who operates on a patient while under the influence may save the patients life, but the risk was still there. It's still something that, policy wise, needs to be addressed. If this were not the case as it happened, if volunteer firefighters under the influence went to a house fire and because of being under the influence made mistakes that cost people their lives, that's my point. That it *IS* a concern.



In this case? No. These men did all they could, and have all they had, to save people. They were great men, no doubt about it.



However if this is common place, it's an issue. It may not be common place. This was such a big event, that perhaps under normal circumstances this isn't ever an issue, in which case, I'd agree. Running the story would have been completely unneeded. I can't say if it happens regularly, or if it just happened this time because of the magnitude of the fire, you know?

_______Nope_________ 23772 posts
9th Aug
Quoting Ravey Candyass:" because it's population is under 3000. the size DOES matter. when there's n explosion that big, you ... [snip!] ... that big, you need as much help as possible. and i'm sure that's exactly what was going through these two mens' heads."


You seem to be missing my point.



I've said many times, I have NOTHING against these men. Nothing at all. I repeat that they were great men who gave everything they had to protect people.



Believing that, if this happens a lot, that the policy needs to be reevaluated doesn't diminish my feelings that these men did all they could to help, that they did everything they did for the good of other people.



They shouldn't be drug through the mud at all. No one should feel less for them because of this, it doesn't change their aid or sacrifice at all.



And I can understand the idea that, in such a small town, people might have responded here that wouldn't have normally responded in less of a crisis (meaning that this isnt' something that happens often, volunteer firefighters being under the influence). If that's the case, then I agree, the story wasn't needed. If it's an ongoing problem, something that is being seen a lot, then I can see the use in such a story. Not to tarnish these mens memories at all, but rather alert peopel to the fact that this risk is happening and should be dealt with.

The Time Police TTC since Apr 2014; 1 angel baby; Cold Lake, AB, Canada 33337 posts
status 9th Aug
Quoting she nan igans:" I think it was a case where it shows there is an issue with policy. That they need to review policy ... [snip!] ... and is clearly an issue. It is a safety risk. It doesn't mean they are not heroes or wonderful people, but it shows a problem. "


That is all well and good, but they could have went about it without disclosing that specific information.

The Time Police TTC since Apr 2014; 1 angel baby; Cold Lake, AB, Canada 33337 posts
status 9th Aug
Quoting Just Ames:" I asked if you knew the size of West, Texas because you said this could be reason to investigate further ... [snip!] ... were not getting paid for this service. They did it out of the kindness of their hearts and that should be what's talked about."


Yes! They are average day people who volunteer. My town is the exact same way, so not all of them fully understand the risks... They are not as trained. That is something that should be required, but they did it because they truly want to help... Not because of a paycheque.

_______Nope_________ 23772 posts
9th Aug
Quoting Spacetits:" That is all well and good, but they could have went about it without disclosing that specific information."


And you know what? You're right. It was unneeded details.

May♥ 1 child; Texas 9167 posts
9th Aug
Quoting she nan igans:" I don't. I also missed the connection I guess, why the side of West TX mattered. I think the story ... [snip!] ... is very sad because no matter the autopsy reports I do think they were brave men who gave their lives trying to help people."


West, Texas is only a couple miles from me. It effected this whole area emotionally. I cried and mourned for everyone involved and yet, I'm not mad that the paper printed what they did...

BRowell 3 kids; 2 angel babies; Bristol, TN, United States 3681 posts
status 9th Aug

I don't know how I feel about it. I feel bad that they disclosed the information like that. They could've just alerted the fire department that these two men had been drinking and still responded and they could've reevaluated policy or whatever. It might just be that they only responded because it was a huge inncedent and they needed everyone and had it not been so big they wouldn't have. I do think they are heros and not terrible people because of this. I mean, it's the news though. They dig things up and report it.